Friday, April 14, 2017

Seton Family of Walter aka Seier 'the Fleming' de Seton

(Jody Gray) because of all the confusion surrounding our Ancestor, 27th GGF Walter aka Seier the Fleming, de Seton, I’m using this Blog Post as a cross-reference to Blog Post: Woodhull Lineage in England.
In researching our earliest ancestors, before the time of “surnames”, one of the main challenges is the practice of using the same “given name” over and over e.g. naming a son after a father (and often using the name again when the first one died); siblings using the name (uncles and nephews with the same name); in general, the practice of naming a child after a king… to differentiate one person from another person, nicknames were used and places (e.g. cities) were used.
  Never, in my research of an ancestor, have I come across anyone with so many names: Walter aka Seirer ‘the Fleming’ de Seton [Walter of Flanders]; Walter de Lens; Dougall the Black Stranger; “Seigneur” de Seton; Walter Flandrensis; Walter de Cambray; Walter of Douai … and, Walter named his son Walter and I found reference that they were both nicknamed "Dougall the Black Stranger"... refer to the end of this Blog Post -Conclusion, For my Ancestry.com Family Tree, I use: Walter aka Seirer ‘the Fleming’ de Seton...

(Jody Gray) this geni.com Project for Odell and Wahull Manors, Bedfordshire, England is covered in the Blog Post: Woodhull Lineage in England. As a group project, all the information located about the "subject" is gathered together and referenced...
https://www.geni.com/projects/Odell-Castle-Estate-Odell-Wahull-Manors-Bedfordshire-England/29813   [geni.com - Projetcs] Odell Castle Estate (Odell & Wahull Manors), Bedfordshire, England.

Domesday Book of 1086. There are two manors of Odell recorded in the Domesday Book. 1. Arnulf of Andres (near Calais) held the manor from Count Eustace II of Boulogne. Before 1066 Alfwold, a thegn of King Edward the Confessor had held the manor; he was deprived of it by the new Norman King. Later identified with the Little Odell Manor… 2. a larger, more important manor, was held by Walter of Flanders [granted] directly from King William I. after he deprived its Anglo-Saxon thegn, Leofnoth. 1. Barony of Odell. The medieval Barony of Odell sprang from the second -Walter of Flanders’ manor in Bedfordshire as well as in Northamptonshire and Hertfordshire and Buckinghamshire. Baron de Wahull’s responsibility was to provide the guards for the castle of Rockingham in Northamptonshire…
2. Odell Manor. Walter the Fleming’s manor descended with the Barony of Odell until 1632 when Richard Chetwood alienated it to Roger Nicholls and Thomas Tirrell….

Walter the Fleming was succeeded by his son Walter and the title can be traced as follows: Walter the Fleming; Walter de Wahull; Simon de Wahull (flourished around the middle of the 12th century)...
https://www.geni.com/people/Walter-Dougall-the-Black-Stranger-de-Seton/6000000020013663002 geni.com -Walter, (Dougall “the Black Stranger”) de Seton aka “Seier”, “de Seton”, “the Fleming”, “de Lens”, “Saher”. b. 1066, Cambray, Ernes, Calvados, Lower Normandy, France (Jody Gray) (since he was born in 1066, this would not be the Walter brought to England in 1066 by his stepmother Adelaide); d. 1124 in Scotland m: Jonet de Quincy *parentage unknown…
About: The Early Seton Family. (Jody Gray) I'm reprinting this section, inserting comments throughout, comparing the information to what I use in my Ancestry.com Family Tree -my comments in blue font e.g. a simple [yes] when the information agrees with what I use.
[Walter aka Seier 'the Fleming' de Seton] Seier de Seton (I) and his brother Walter sprang from a 2nd son of the house of Boulogne [yes]. Known in their Flemish homeland as Seier and Walter de Lens, they were sons of Count Eustace I’s [Count of Boulogne and Count of Lens] second son, Count Lambert [II] de Lens [yes], whose daughter by a second marriage (to the sister of William the Conqueror [yes, Adelaide of Normandy]) was the Countess Judith [yes, of Lens], mother of Scotland’s Queen Maud [yes, aka Matilda of Huntingdon *m: David I, King of Scots].
  Count Lambert died [1054, Walter aka Seier, age 4] when the boys were too young to administer to the important estates of Lens, and thus they followed the Flemish military contingent into England with their half-sister’s husband [stepmother, 2nd wife, Adelaide of Normandy -she married 3rd, Odo, Count of Champagne in 1060 *his wikipedia page says that he accompanied his brother-in-law in the Norman conquest of England in 1066 *he was Count of Aumale by right of marriage to Adelaide *their son, Stephen, Count of Aumale], Duke William of Normandy, in his quest for the English crown and settled there in the north following William’s success. Count Lambert himself was the 2nd son of his father, Eustace I of Boulogne [yes], and brother of Eustace II [yes], they were lineally descended in both Eustace I’s mother and father from King Charles I, Charlemagne, Holy Roman Emperor and the first of the Carolingian Empire [yes, Baldwin I ‘Iron Arm’ founder of the House of Flanders, m: Judith, Princess of West Francia; daughter of Charles ‘the Bald’, King of West Francia; grandson of Charlemagne *though I don’t follow the lineage of Adelina of Holland, it does lead back to Charlemagne]

  (Jody Gray) the following information is completely confusing, to me: the son of the 1st Seirer? Walter aka Seier is the 1st Seier (son of Lambert II, Count of Lens and Count of Aumale who died in 1054) this Seier married Jonet de Quincy; they had two sons, a Walter and a Saher… so… everything lines up after the 1st sentence…

  The son of the 1st Seier de Seton, of de Lens, is known as Dougall de Setoun and his Christian name was Walter, however he was usually described by a familiar appellation in the language of the Scots people around him. He was baron of the town and lands of Setoun (Seton) [yes] and married Janet (Jonet) [yes], daughter of Robert de Quincy [yes]) and had a son also called Seier (2nd) [yes, Saher] who is often confused with his grandfather.
  His wife’s father Robert de Quincy [yes] had married Maud de St. Liz [no, wife’s name is unknown] daughter of Simon de St. Liz, Earl of Huntington and Northhampton and Maud aka Matilda, the elder of the daughters of Waltheof, Earl of Northumberland and Judith de Lens, the niece to King William I of England [they did have a daughter, Maud aka Matilda of St Liz she m2: Saer de Quincy NOT Robert de Quincy]

  To appreciate these ties, note that William (the Conqueror) married Matilda of Flanders [yes], a cousin of Dougall. Likewise, Dougall’s grandfather [no, Walter aka Seier’s, Lambert II] married as his 2nd wife Adele aka Adelaide of Normandy, William’s sister]; it made the Setoun’s cousins of the English King and his sons, William II and Henry I. [yes] Henry I married the daughter of Malcolm III, King of the Scots [yes, Matilda aka Edith]; and 2nd, Adela of Bas-Lorraine [yes, but I have Adeliza of Louvain], a cousin of Count Lambert Lens, Dougall’s grandfather [didn’t find this connection]. Malcolm III’s youngest son, later King David I, married Matilda the 2nd daughter of Waltheof, Earl of Northumberland [yes]. Domesday hints towards the identity of Count Lambert’s sons: In that book are just their Christian names; Walter and Seier, and it is obvious from the wording that Seier is absent. Walter, “brother of Seier”, was still holding lands in 1086 but Seier’s possessions had been passed to his elder son Walter (or Dougall), described in the documents as “Walter Flandrensis” -Walter of Flanders, or the Fleming. He and his brother Hugh [no, I couldn't find a Hugh de Seton] are given as tenants-in-chief of the vast string of Midlands manors, and the estates in Scotland, Seier had been granted lands by the Scottish king, Malcolm Canmore aka Malcolm III. [yes]
Walter, (Dougall “the Black Stranger”) de Seton’s Timeline
b. 1066 [no, ca. 1050, his father died in 1054, and his father married his stepmother, Addelaide ca. 1053], Ernes, Calvados, Lower Normandy, France
his son, b. 1085, Walter de Wahull I, Wahull Manor, Bedfordshire, England
his son, b. 1087, Saher de Seton II, Seton, East Lothian, Scotland
d. 1124, (Walter) at Scotland (age 58)
Sometimes confused with Walter the Fleming, Walter of Douai was the Fleming who held the greatest number of estates in Somerset (Devon) where his brother was also to be found… the Walter of Flanders who became Baron of Wahull with a majority of lands in Bedford and Northampton.
Dougall the Black Stranger [Walter of Douai]
Town of Douai in Flanders… Douaisien merchant
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Douai Douai, Flanders: From the 10th century the town was a romance fiefdom of the counts of Flanders. The town became a flourishing textile market center during the Middle Ages, historically known as Douay or Doway in English...
*https://www.geni.com/people/Walter-Dougall-the-Black-Stranger-de-Seton/6000000020013663002?through=6000000002187965124 Walter Dougall the Black Stranger de Seton *states, his ancestry very unclear and lists parents as “not known” (I have his father as Lambert II, Count of Lens) b. 1066, Cambray, Ernes, Calvados, Lower Normandy, France d. 1124, Scotland m: Jonet de Quincy b. 1068, Winchester, Hampshire, England d. ?; daughter of Robert de Quincy b. 1040, Cuinchy, Pas-de-Calais, Nord-Pas-de-Calais, France d. ? Scotland
  Walter de Seton and Jonet de Quincy: elder son, Walter de Wahull b. ca 1085, Wahull Manor, Bedfordshire, England d. 1147 Bedford, England; his son, Simon de Wahull b. 1110 Pateshull, Odell, Bedfordshire, England d. 1149 Thenford, Northamptonshire, England m: Sibyl d’Anjou b. 1112 Anjou, Isere, Rhone-Alpes, France d. 1165. *no parents listed for her… (Jody Gray) on the geni.com profile of Sibyl d’Anjoy, Overview TAB, About: (her son) Walter de Wahull b. 1130, Odell, Cranfield, Bedfordshire, England d. 1174, Wahull Manor, Bedfordshire, England -reference to Albreda Taillesbois [Henry II] “on the assessment of the aid for marrying the King’s daughter” may be referring to his “aiding” in her marriage… however, it goes on to say “by his first wife, Albreda, widow of Guy de St. Valery, Walter de Wahull had no issue, but by Roesia, his second wife, he had two daughters and two sons, Simon and John (which doesn’t mention, Walter b. 1169, that I have in my lineage)... confusing, I found her marriage to Guy de St. Valery but no mention of her marrying Walter de Wahull.

 Other Sources: e.g. Wikipedia pages...
http://familypedia.wikia.com/wiki/Seier_de_Lens_(%3F-%3F) Seier Dougall de Lens b. 1054 to Lambert II de Lens (d. 1054) and Adelaide of Normandy (c.1026-c.1090) Notable ancestors include Charlemagne… (Jody Gray) Seier is not the son of Adelaide, Lambert II’s 2nd wife, they married in 1053; Seier (mother’s name is unknown) would have been born before 1053)
http://familypedia.wikia.com/wiki/Hugh_de_Seton_(c1060-c1107) Hugh de Seton b. ca. 1060 to Seier de Lens (see above) d. 1107 *Hugh’s descendants include the Leghs of Cheshire… (Jody Gray) I find no other Google Search results for Hugh de Seton.
  *Flanders -their Flemish homeland -where they were known as de Lens (sons of Count Eustace I’s 2nd son Count Lambert de Lens; his father, Eustace I of Boulogne) -
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eustace_I,_Count_of_Boulogne (Lambert II’s father) Eustace I. succeeded his father as Count of Boulogne in 1042; was also the Count of Lens (castle there) which passed to his son Lambert at his death (1049). Eustace was allied to the ducal house of Normandy by the marriage of his son Eustace II to Goda (daughter of Ethelred the Unready, King of England and Emma of Normandy; daughter of Richard I ‘the Fearless’ Duke of Normandy), niece of Richard II ‘the Good’ Duke of Normandy). Under Eustace I the Counts of Boulogne rose to great prominence in Northern France. Notes (from the reference section): Matilda aka Maud was a direct descendant of Charlemagne and in terms of rank descendants of Charlemagne were among the most prestigious brides. Noble families of the 11th and 12th centuries sought to trace their descent specifically into the Carolingian line. (Jody Gray) her mother Gerberga was the daughter of Charles, Duke of Lower Lorraine, himself the son of Louis IV of France and Gerberga of Saxony, making him the 3rd great-grandson of Charlemagne.
http://familypedia.wikia.com/wiki/Lambert_II_de_Lens_(-1054) Lambert II Boulogne de Lens, Count of Lens, Count of Aumale, was born on an unknown date to Eustache I de Boulogne (c. 995-1049) and Mahaut de Louvain (c. 1001-c.1049) and died 1054 at the Battle of Lille of unspecified causes. He married Adelaide of Normandy (c. 1026-1090). Notable ancestors include Charlemagne (747-814), Alfred the Great (849-899). Ancestors are from France, the United Kingdom, Belgium, Germany. Note that Seier and Walter may have been born to an earlier, unknown wife of Lambert.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lambert_II,_Count_of_Lens Lambert II, Count of Lens, d. 1054 was a French nobleman. Son of Eustace I, Count of Boulogne and Maud de Leuven; daughter of Lambert I of Leuven. ca. 1053 m: Adelaide of Normandy, Countess of Aumale (widow of Enguerrand II, Count of Ponthieu, d. 1053 -Adelaide retained her dowry of Aumale; Lambert became Count of Aumale by right of marraige); they were parents of Judith of Lens. Adelaide aka Adeliza m3: Odo, Count of Champage; they were parents of Stephen, Count of Aumale who m: Hawise, daughter of Ralph de Mortimer, Lord of Wigmore; their daughter Agnes m2: Adam I de Brus, Lord of Skelton (cousin to Robert I 'the Bruce' de Brus, King of Scots).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aumale Aumale, formerly known as Albemarle, is a commune in the Seine-Maritime department of the Haute-Normandie region in north-western France. History. The town’s Latin name was Alba Maria. It was raised by William the Bastard aka William the Conqueror into a county...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Counts_and_dukes_of_Aumale Counts and dukes of Aumale. The County of Aumale, later elevated to a duchy, was a medieval fief in Normandy. It was disputed between England and France during parts of the Hundred Years’ War.
Bertha of Aumale (daughter) 1048-1052 m: Hugh II, Count of Ponthieu 1048-1052…
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hugh_II,_Count_of_Ponthieu Hugh II… succeeded by his son, Enquerrand II, Count of Ponthieu…
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enguerrand_II,_Count_of_Ponthieu Enguerrand II… m: Adelaide, daughter of Robert I, Duke of Normandy and sister of William the Conqueror. But at the Council of Reims in 1049, when the proposed marriage of Duke William and Matilda of Flanders was prohibited based on consanguinity, so was Enguerrand’s existing marriage to Adelaide, causing him to be excommunicated. The marriage was apparently annulled ca. 1049/50. He had given her a dower, Aumale, which she retained after the dissolution of their marriage (they had a daughter, Adelaide II, Countess of Aumale who later m: William de Breteuil); Enguerrand died without male issue he was followed by his brother Guy I as Count of Ponthieu.
(pg 683) Lambert de Lens, Count of Lens (Eustace I, Matilda) was also known as “Lambert of Boulogne” and attended the court of Henry III, Emperor of Germany in 1047. He was the Count of Lens in Artois, married Adelaide of Normandy, and was killed during the Battle of Lille in 1054, at about the same time as the occasion of the birth of Judith.
  Adeliza, Countess of Aumale (Robert I, Herleve) has also been called “Adelaide”, “Adela”, or “Adelais, Countess of Albamarla”. She was born ca. 1030 and was the sister or half-sister of William the Conqueror. She married three times in rapid succession. Her first husband, Enguerrand II, Count of Ponthieu, died in Oct. 1053 during the Battle of Saint-Aubin in the Siege of Arques, he was stabbed to death. Her second husband, Lambert, died in 1054, and she married her third husband, Eudes, Count of Champagne and Aumale and Earl of Holderness, in 1054, 1056, or about 1060. With Eudes, she was the mother of Stephen, Count of Aumale. Eudes was imprisoned in 1096, and Adeliza died between 1081 and 1084, or sometime after 1080 but before 1091.

  Rodulf II de Warenne “Ralph II” married Emma, with whom he was the father of Rodulf III and William I. He was probably the son of Rodulf I (aka Ralph I de Warenne) and Beatrice. Rudolph’s surname originated from the hamlet of Varenne on the River Varenne...

 (Jody Gray) the period in which Walter aka Seier lived was a full of Historic Events, most specifically, Battle of Hastings in 1066; after which William the Conqueror became the first Norman King of England (ending the rule of the Anglo-Saxon kings -House of Wessex). Walter's uncle, Eustace II, Count of Boulogne is one of the few proven "Companions of William the Conqueror". Walter's grandfather, Eustace I, Count of Boulogne, had two sons: 1st son, Eustace II, succeeded him as Count of Boulogne; 2nd son, Lambert II, became Count of Lens and Count of Aumale (by his 2nd marriage to Adelaide). Because he fought beside William the Conqueror at the Battle of Hastings, Eustace II received large grants of land forming an honour [a great lordship, comprising dozens or hundreds of manors] in England.
Refer to Media / Blog Post: Battle of Hastings aka Battle of Senlac, 1066. http://historicalandmisc.blogspot.com/2016/11/battle-of-hastings-aka-battle-of-senlac.html *
Alliances of William the Conqueror. William the Conqueror became the 1st Norman King of England. Immediately following his rise to the throne of England, he dispossessed Anglo-Saxon nobility of their lands and granted their lands to his supporters. *Eustace II, Count of Boulogne, one of the few proven Companions of William the Conqueror...

Reminder: The Family of Seton is covered in the Blog Post: Woodhull Lineage in England (New Information added, by me, 12/9/2016) Clan Seton. I'm reviewing the information to see if there is anything that I need to add, here.


Other, Seton Family Alliances.

References from Blog Post: Woodhull Lineage in England. (New Information added, by me, 12/9/2016) Clan Seton. Of the Seton family The Great Historic Families Of Scotland says: The Setons are among the most illustrious of the great houses of Scotland, conspicuous throughout their whole history for their loyalty and firm attachment to the Stewart dynasty, in whose cause they perilled and lost their titles and extensive estates.’...  The family continued to marry into powerful alliances and later Sir Christopher Seton (Sir Chrystell) married Christian Bruce, sister of Robert the Bruce. After his legendary support of his brother-in-law he was captured by the English, taken to London, then executed at Dumfries. One of his brothers, Sir John Seton, shared the same fate. Alexander Seton, Sir Christopher's son, survived the wars of independence to be a signatory of the Arbroath Declaration. He also was a recipient of King Robert’s gratitude towards the family: the existing Seton lands were enlarged by means of adding those confiscated from anglo-supporters, and a large stretch of East Lothian coastline became Seton territory.



*Seton Family connection to de Quincy Family.

References from Blog Post: Woodhull Lineage in England. (New Information added, by me, 12/9/2016) Clan Seton.

  The family’s founder, Seier de Seton (or de Lens), had been granted lands in East Lothian to which he gave his own name. His son, Walter de Seton (also called Dougall), married Janet de Quincy, heiress of that once powerful family, and gained the lands of Tranent bordering his own.

Dougall de Seton aka Walter (the Fleming) de Lens b. abt 1056 m: Janet de Quincy. *Churchill’s 26th GGM ?
Father, Saher IV de Quincy
Robert I de Quincy (1125 ? - 1197)
Saher de Quency (Lord of Daventry) 1106 ? - 1158
Saher de Quinch
Richard de Quincy

(Jody Gray) de Quincy Family: I did not find a Pedigree lineage for the de Quincy (verifiable vitals, etc). The only de Quincy that has a Wikipedia page is Saer aka Saher de Quincy who signed the 1215 Magna Charta m: Margaret of Leicester (de Beaumont)
http://www.armidalesoftware.com/issue/full/Thaler_187_main.html Descendants Saher I de Quincy m: Maud de St. Liz…
(Jody Gray) the web site, below, for the de Quincy Family, doesn't include Jonet de Quincy and doesn't connect to the Seton Family. It does, however, connect to my Ancestry.com Family Tree, if indeed, Jonet had a brother, 28th great-uncle, Richard de Quincy b. 1066 (his linage) Saher de Quincy b. 1100; Robert the Crusader de Quincy b. 1140; Saer aka Saher de Quincy (signer of the 1215 Magna Charta); Hawise de Quincy...

http://www.dequinceyfamily.co.uk/page3.htm de Quincy Family *the first de Quincy’s are Roger, Robert and Richard all born c. 1035. Roger had a son Roger b. 1060 m: Maud three other sons Saher, Hamelin, Odon.
(Jody Gray) in blue font, the information I use in my Ancestry.com Family Tree. Saher de Quincy, Lord of Buckby 1090-1158 [1100-1158, Ancestry] m: Maud de St. Liz [Maude aka Matilda de Senlis] 1096-1140 [d. 1163, Ancestry]; their son, Robert [the Crusader] de Quincey 1135-1197 [1127-1197, QuincyFamilyTree] m: Orabella de Leuchars [Orabilis aka Orabella of Leuchars aka Mars, Ancestry -from her son's Wikipedia page: Orabilis de Mar] 1136-1181 [6/30/1203, Ancestry]. Their son, [Saer aka] Saher de Quincey [Quincy] 1155-1219 [1170-11/3/1219, Wikipedia, FAG], 1st Earl of Winchester and Crusader died in Palestine [Damietta, Egypt] m: Margaret de Beaumont [d. 1/12/1235, Ancestry, FAG] in 1173 [couldn't be married in 1173 if he was born in 1170, as his Wikipedia page states]. Their children Loretta 1180, John 1182, Reginald 1184, Beatrice 1185, Arabella 1186-1258, Robert 1186-1257 (went with his father to the Crusades) Roger 2nd Earl of Winchester 1190-1264 m: Helen of Galloway d. 1246 m2: Matilda d. 1252 m3: Eleanor…(Jody Gray) I don't list any of these children; I list their daughter Hawise m: Hugh de Vere, 4th Earl of Oxford -because of the Piper Family connection to the (Noble) de Vere Family.

Other, de Quincy Family Sources:
Robert de Quincy b. 1040, Cuinchy, Normandy, France; his father, Richard de Quincy b. abt 1000, Normandy, France. (daughter of Robert) Janet de Quincy b. 1068 m: Dougall de Seton b. 1060 (see, below)
Dougall de Seton b. 1060 (Jody Gray, would work for his birth year and make him age 6 when brought to England by his stepmother Adelaide of Normandy -but at age 6 he would not have been of “fighting age” -Battle of Hastings, 1066 as some information states...) m: 1077 (age 17) Janet de Quincy (age 9); son Sehier de Seton b. 1087 in Seton, East Lothian, Scotland.
Dougall’s father (in this Website): Saher De Saye b. 1030 d. ? *does match father, Lambert II *Dougall’s grandfather (in this Website) Picot de Saye… (Jody Gray) I decided not to use this website as a resource because this reference to Dougall's father as Picot de Saye, not Lambert...

Other, de Quincy Sources: (Jody Gray) I found this Quincy Family Tree and used it to fill in "vitals" for our de Quincy Family Ancestors. It doesn't list Jonet de Quincy; it starts with her brother, Richard de Quincy b. 1066. The locations and the names fit with what I already had. *information that I have that is "in addition" to the information to what's provided in [blue font].
Robert [de Quincy, Earl of Leicester] was b. 1127 in Long Buckley, England. His parents: Saher de Quincy b. 1100 and Maud St. Liz [Maude aka Matilda de Senlis of St Liz, Wikipedia]. His paternal grandparents: Richard de Quincy b. 1066 and ? His maternal grandparents: Simon de St. Liz [de Senlis of Senliz. Wikipedia], Earl of Huntingdon and Northampton and Matilda of Huntingdon. Robert [de Quincy, Earl of Leicester] d. 9/29/1197, Manor of Buckley, Northampton, England.
http://familytrees.genopro.com/azrael/skaggs/deQuincy-Robert-ind04374.htm Quincy Family Tree -Ancestor Pedigree Chart *begins with Richard de Quincey b. 1066… Saher de Quincey b. 1100… Robert de Quincy, Earl of Leicester b. 1127 d. 9/29/1197... Saer aka Saher de Quincy, Earl of Winchester d. 11/3/1219 *Surety for the Magna Charat, 1215...

Other, Seton Family Sources:
(Jody Gray): I haven't found a "Pedigree" (Scotland) Seton Family Tree. I found this one (below) but the only person that has a Wikipedia page is Christopher de Seton who married Christina de Brus, sister of Robert I 'the Bruce', King of Scots.
https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/1911_Encyclop%C3%A6dia_Britannica/Seton 1911 Encyclopedia Britannica - Seton. The Scottish family of Seton, Seyton or Seatoun, claims descent from a Dougall Seton who lived in the reign of Alexander I. Sir Richard Maitland of Lethington counted seven generations between this personage and Sir Christopher Seton d. 1306 (brother-in-law of Robert the Brus)... son and heir of John de Seton, a Cumberland gentleman, and his wife Erminia Lascelles, was probably born in 1278, since his age is given in Dlarch as 21, in an inquisition into the lands of his deceased father… He had married about 1301 Christian Bruce, sister of King Robert, who was possibly his 2nd cousin… he was hanged as a traitor at Dumfries by order of Edward I. He left no heirs…
  Sir Alexander Seton d. ca 1360 was probably the brother of Sir Christopher… 1333 defended the town of Berwick against the English… giving his eldest surviving son Thomas as hostage… was hanged… An elder son, Alexander, had perished in 1332 in opposing the landing of Edward Baliol; according to some 3rd son, William was hanged with his brother (generally he’s said to have drowned); his daughter Margaret m: Alan de Wintoun.
  Sir William Seton (fl 1371-1393) said to have been ennobled with the title of Lord Seton, and his heirs laid claim that the barony of Seton was the oldest in Scotland. By his wife Catherine Sinclair he had 8 children. John succeeded him… Sir John of Seton d. ca 1441 was taken prisoner at Homildon Hill in 1402; was hostage in 1405 and again in 1423. m: Lady Janet Dunbar… (Jody Gray) the above "probably" and "said to have been" led me to end here regarding this "Seton Family History" (by Sir Richard Maitland of Lethington -see, below, Earl of Winton)... I removed some Seton ancestors from my Ancestry.com family tree...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earl_of_Winton Earl of Winton. The title was once created in the Peerage of Scotland and again the Peerage of the United Kingdom… first bestowed on Robert Seton, 8th Lord Seton… The Lords Seton were the Premier Barons of Scotland until the creation of the Earldom of Winton in 1600. Sir Richard Maitland of Lethington wrote in his History of the House of Seytoune to the Year 1559, that Sir William Seton, “...was the First created and made Lord of Parliament in Scotland…” -Paternal Ancestor of the 1st Lord Seton: Walter “Dougall” de Seton b. ca 1060 Scotland -Sir William Seton, 1st Lord Seton (d. c. 1410) created 1st Lord Seton in 1371. (son of son of Alan de Wyntoun and Margaret de Seton)...

Place - Location: Odell aka Wodhull -
Water had properties in East Midlands of England, counties of Northampton, Bedford, Huntington...
References from Blog Post: Woodhull Lineage in England. (New Information added, by me, 12/9/2016) Clan Seton. Seire's eldest son, Walter de Lens aka Walter 'the Fleming' as he is described in Domesday (1086), had his chief English home at Wahull (now called Odell) in Bedfordshire. On the Firth of Forth [Scotland -the River Forth meets the North Sea with Fife on the north coast and Lothian on the south], as heir there of his father, Seier, he was called Dougall or "the dark stranger", a nickname which was also given to his son Walter...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firth_of_Forth Map -Firth of Forth, shows Edinburgh (before the Forth Bridge) the Firth ends just before Stirling…
  In both Scotland and Bedfordshire, and no doubt in the lost Yorkshire home of the family. Seier de Lens (or Seier de Seton) and his descendants kept as princely establishment as they had enjoyed in Flanders -a fact attested by a curious documentary survival. As if he had been a king, Walter de Wahull had tenants-in-chief, each with his own tenants. The terms these courtiers enjoyed on his estates at Odell (in England) are known, and although relevant Scottish documents have not survived, it is certain that the Seton tenants on the Firth of Forth (in Scotland) had been given similar privileges. The Victoria County History for Bedfordshire records, not without astonishment, the fairy-tale rents paid by Walter’s knightly tenants in that county as “a Prikeavant provided a hooded falcon, while Walter le Sergeaunt, keeper of the park at Odell Castle, held his cottage by the service of twelve arrows. At the neighboring Little Odell Manor, whose Domesday tenant-in-chief was Walter’s great-uncle, Count Eustace of Boulogne, the tenancies granted to Eustace’s own attendant knights were similar, “a garland of roses, a bundle of rushes, a cake of wax…”
(another entry) A number of years ago Warkworth Castle was burned to the ground, Odell or Great Wodhull Castle has been in ruins for many years, but Thenford Manor with its ancient chapel still remain In the reign of Henry VIII. Nicholas Wodhull, son and heir of Fulk Wodhull, devised Thenford to Fulk Wodhull, Esq., his eldest son by his second with, Elizabeth Parr, daughter and heir of Sir William Parr, of Horton, and it continued in the Wodhull family down to the extinction of the line upon the death of Michael Wodhull, Esq. (1815). *matches information in my Ancestry.com Family Tree: 12th GGF Nicholas Woodhull was born and died in Warkworth; his son 11th GGF Fulk Woodhull, Knight was born in Thenford.

Conclusion, For my Ancestry.com Family Tree, I use -
*Walter aka Seirer ‘the Fleming’ de Seton
b. ca 1050, Cambrai, Nord-Pas-de-Calais, France
1066, taken to England by Adelaide of Normandy (William the Conqueror’s half-sister, their stepmother) after the Battle of Hastings
1069, fled to Scotland after a military misadventure had brought him into serious disfavor with William I, King of England; Walter was granted land by Malcolm III, King of Alba (Scotland), Seton became his family estate.
1085, married Jonet de Quincy, daughter and heiress of Robert de Quincy; she brought as her dowry, the lands of St. Germains and Winton to the Seton family.
1085, birth of son Walter de Wahull in Bedford, England (as eldest son he inherited the Wahull Estates in England)
1087, birth of son Saher de Seton in Seton, East Lothian, Scotland (he inherited the Seton Estates in Scotland)
d. 1124, Scotland
*Walter aka Seier the Fleming de Seton.
Ancestry.com Media: Parents of Walter aka Seier ‘the Fleming’ de Seton. *(only) attached to Walter…

Medieval Ancestors: some “Pedigree” Family Trees list birth dates, before birth records were available. I’ve learned these “birth dates” were “calculated” using the first ancestor whose birth date is from a “verified” source and going backwards… Genealogists often use references to the period of time they lived in (“flourished” in [fl] ) -often, the “reign” of a king as a point of reference. The time period may be learned because an ancestor witnessed a legal document…

  Walter’s birth date is based on the narrative that when he was taken to England by his stepmother in 1066 he was old enough to fight (in the Battle of Hastings) if just barely. If he was born in 1050 he would be 16; boys were known to fight in battle at an even younger age. The age of “maturity” was 21; the age when a male could administer -prior to that, if his father was deceased, he was assigned a guardian, a “regent”.
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*(Jody Gray) I’m “leaving-off” here… I created a NEW Blog Post: Research, Eustace I and his son, Lambert II as grandfather and father of Walter aka Seier de Fleming. 
http://historicalandmisc.blogspot.com/2017/04/research-eustace-i-and-his-son-lambert.html *
-to further research Walter’s father, grandfather… looking for information for the 1054, Battle of Lille and the 1067, attack at Dover… using Google Search… I include information from Seton Family websites -Sources - Seton Family.
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